Kevin Francis: Senators draft picks/Sens rumours heating up Hockey

Should have trade for Reinhardt!!

“This was a nice pick considering where many had him projected to be.” Odd comment considering he was Projected in 4th or 5th round
And the Sens moved back to select Ben Rogers, who they could have got a couple of rounds later.
The Sens are good at finding diamonds in the ruff, but it’s not a diamond in the ruff if you pay a diamonds price for it. Imagine how good our drafting would be if they just selected these guys where they would have most likely gone.

lets be honest here, if not for pure luck in the Karlson trade dorion would be up for discussion as worst GM in the NHL, he seems unwilling or incapable do to incompetence to make trades for players like Reinhart, who costs was reasonable, while drafter players in early rounds who should have gone in later rounds leaving better players on the board.

There is a difference between picking Brady at 4 when he was slotted by most scouts to go between 4 and 8 to picking Boucher who most scouts had going in the 2nd round at 10th OA, crapshoot draft or not.

I'm sorry, but there is no world in which Zack Ostapchuk is objectively a "nice pick considering where many had him projected to be", when drafted at #38 overall in the 2020/21 NHL draft. Then we get a future pylon of a d-man, and a Swedish player in the 4th round that was barely ranked by anyone in hockey.

Plus, the second that the #10 pick was going to be Tyler Boucher, they should have been on the phone to Buffalo to pick up Sam Reinhart. How on Earth did that deal not get made? The #10 overall pick alone should have closed that deal.

Wasted opportunities, wasted assets. Please stop putting lipstick on this hideous pig of a draft performance.

I understand the frustration picking players significantly ahead of where they are ranked. I am not 100% sure the thought process by Dorion and co but it would be nice burn assets. It happened at last years draft and happened again this year. Dorion has always been a safe draft GM. Has only a few prospects in mind and locks them up. There is no wheeling and dealing to get those prospects plus others pieces to add to the cupboard, which you should be able to do if you are going to go off the board.

Nevertheless, this years draft is more or less a crapshoot. The rankings meant less than any other year in recent memory, so I suppose you don't want to play with fire. At least they didn't pull what Montreal did...

I'm sorry, but there is no world in which Zack Ostapchuk is objectively a "nice pick considering where many had him projected to be", when drafted at #38 overall in the 2020/21 NHL draft. Then we get a future pylon of a d-man, and a Swedish player in the 4th round that was barely ranked by anyone in hockey.

Plus, the second that the #10 pick was going to be Tyler Boucher, they should have been on the phone to Buffalo to pick up Sam Reinhart. How on Earth did that deal not get made? The #10 overall pick alone should have closed that deal.

Wasted opportunities, wasted assets. Please stop putting lipstick on this hideous pig of a draft performance.
- khawk

Dorion has a reputation in the league for being a good scout / judge of future talent. Whether or not that's really fair is unclear, but we've seen him go off the board quite a bit in the past.

I do wonder after this draft if Dorion has bought into his press too much, and thinks he's the smartest guy in the room with so many reaches and off the board picks. We'll get a better idea in the next couple years as some of those reaches continue to develop

I really like the character of this team.

I understand the joy that some people get from nit picking individual selections but you need to understand your problem is not with Dorion's selections, it is with his hockey philosophy.

He takes a Sanderson over a Drysdale because he wants the size and grit over the skill. You are always going to believe he could have made a better skill choice but he will always disappoint you.

After the selection of Boucher, Brady texted Dorion and basically said he is our kind of player. These guys really believe in what they are doing. I also believe in them.

I really like the character of this team.

I understand the joy that some people get from nit picking individual selections but you need to understand your problem is not with Dorion's selections, it is with his hockey philosophy.

He takes a Sanderson over a Drysdale because he wants the size and grit over the skill. You are always going to believe he could have made a better skill choice but he will always disappoint you.

After the selection of Boucher, Brady texted Dorion and basically said he is our kind of player. These guys really believe in what they are doing. I also believe in them.
- spatso

Not saying Boucher was a bad pick but surely Dorian had to have known he was going to drop & why wouldnt he have parlayed that #10 pick for an extra pick & still get his guy. Im sure Flames would have coughed up one of their extra 3rds to move from 12 to 10 & get Sillinger who I think was their primary target but fcking Columbus took him just before us. Dorian could have gotten extra assets & still got his man.

Not saying Boucher was a bad pick but surely Dorian had to have known he was going to drop & why wouldnt he have parlayed that #10 pick for an extra pick & still get his guy. Im sure Flames would have coughed up one of their extra 3rds to move from 12 to 10 & get Sillinger who I think was their primary target but fcking Columbus took him just before us. Dorian could have gotten extra assets & still got his man.
- Kevin R

Maybe. I was hoping the Sens would take Sillinger.

My guess is the Sens had a list of 2 or 3 players that they would take at 10 based on availability. And when their number came up, Boucher was at the top of their list. We don't know if he might have moved up on the list of other teams. You would certainly want to believe the Rangers would had him near the top of their list.

Wouldn't have hated seing Ray taken with the last second round pick, if their going to "reach".

Although there's for sure a reason he fell so low for every other team to pass on him almost twice.

more than maybe any draft in league history.....the pre-draft rankings here are completely meaningless. more than half the kids in this draft probably played less than 20 games this year, with literally dozens of them not playing at all.

there probably wasn't a single player available to them, even at 10, who's closer than 2-3 years away from being NHL ready......it's silly to comment on good or bad picks at this point, it will be years before we have any clue.

outside of the top 9 skaters.....this draft was a complete crapshoot.....i'm just glad they didn't waste a top 10 pick on a goalie

Maybe. I was hoping the Sens would take Sillinger.

My guess is the Sens had a list of 2 or 3 players that they would take at 10 based on availability. And when their number came up, Boucher was at the top of their list. We don't know if he might have moved up on the list of other teams. You would certainly want to believe the Rangers would had him near the top of their list.
- spatso

you can almost guarantee if any of those top 9 skaters were available at 10, Sens would have taken them........Boucher was probably their "best of the rest" pick

I understand the joy that some people get from nit picking individual selections but you need to understand your problem is not with Dorion's selections, it is with his hockey philosophy.
- spatso

No, you need to understand that regardless of Dorion's philosophy, there is an objective value to the draft picks that he is using in this manner. If you're going to effectively devalue a 1st or 2nd round pick in that regard, then at least use it to trade for some kind of valuable asset. Case in point, I'd far rather see them use the #10 pick to trade for Sam Reinhart, and roll the dice that Tyler Boucher is still available at #39 (which is really quite possible).

Beyond that, I'm also going to suggest that if you look at the players picked immediately after their first two picks plus the player picked in the spot they traded down from, they're going to be embarrassed by what they left on the table with those selections. I'll take the Pepsi challenge all day long about which trio will look better today, tomorrow, next month, next year, and next decade.

Cole Sillinger, Scott Morrow, Francesco Pinelli
Tyler Boucher, Zack Ostapshuk, Ben Roger

I'm dumb enough to actually track this kind of thing for the next several years out of sheer curiosity, but I think you'll find it won't take all that long to figure out. Not to mention that at least the first group of picks is actually TRYING to add scoring line players and a potential 2nd-pairing D to the mix... the picks Ottawa made seem far more like cost-controlled replacements for guys like Watson, Amadio, and J. Brown.

you can almost guarantee if any of those top 9 skaters were available at 10, Sens would have taken them........Boucher was probably their "best of the rest" pick
- sensarmy_11

Agreed.

I was really hoping that we would grab Guenther.

No, you need to understand that regardless of Dorion's philosophy, there is an objective value to the draft picks that he is using in this manner. If you're going to effectively devalue a 1st or 2nd round pick in that regard, then at least use it to trade for some kind of valuable asset. Case in point, I'd far rather see them use the #10 pick to trade for Sam Reinhart, and roll the dice that Tyler Boucher is still available at #39 (which is really quite possible).

Beyond that, I'm also going to suggest that if you look at the players picked immediately after their first two picks plus the player picked in the spot they traded down from, they're going to be embarrassed by what they left on the table with those selections. I'll take the Pepsi challenge all day long about which trio will look better today, tomorrow, next month, next year, and next decade.

Cole Sillinger, Scott Morrow, Francesco Pinelli
Tyler Boucher, Zack Ostapshuk, Ben Roger

I'm dumb enough to actually track this kind of thing for the next several years out of sheer curiosity, but I think you'll find it won't take all that long to figure out. Not to mention that at least the first group of picks is actually TRYING to add scoring line players and a potential 2nd-pairing D to the mix... the picks Ottawa made seem far more like cost-controlled replacements for guys like Paul, Amadio, and Watson.
- khawk

looks like to me dorion is going out of his way to avoid drafting guys who could turn into 9m/high salary players like Point, kuznetsov,rentanen, petterson ect, he is leaving skilled players on the floor and drafting plugs and depth players instead...

Agreed.

I was really hoping that we would grab Guenther.
- SensFan25

they said SJS was looking to move down, so OTT didnt even try for a guy like guenther but went with the 3rd/4th liner that Boucher will turn into

Boucher is the kind of player that can be a dark horse Tom Wilson type.

looks like to me dorion is going out of his way to avoid drafting guys who could turn into 9m/high salary players like Point, kuznetsov,rentanen, petterson ect, he is leaving skilled players on the floor and drafting plugs and depth players instead...
- Mithos

So, you think Tampa took Point thinking he might be a $9m player. Too funny. Is this your first year as a hockey fan? Its okay. Stick around you will learn something if you give yourself a chance.

The reason why most of your comments are ignored is because they don't make a lot of hockey sense. But we all have to learn. Don't get discouraged. Keep trying.

So, you think Tampa took Point thinking he might be a $9m player. Too funny. Is this your first year as a hockey fan? Its okay. Stick around you will learn something if you give yourself a chance.

The reason why most of your comments are ignored is because they don't make a lot of hockey sense. But we all have to learn. Don't get discouraged. Keep trying.
- spatso

you got your head so far up dorions ass no one can tell who is who, all of dorion's poop in your head is interfering with your thought process you praise him no mater what he does, your not even worth the time i spent writing this.

No, you need to understand that regardless of Dorion's philosophy, there is an objective value to the draft picks that he is using in this manner. If you're going to effectively devalue a 1st or 2nd round pick in that regard, then at least use it to trade for some kind of valuable asset. Case in point, I'd far rather see them use the #10 pick to trade for Sam Reinhart, and roll the dice that Tyler Boucher is still available at #39 (which is really quite possible).

Beyond that, I'm also going to suggest that if you look at the players picked immediately after their first two picks plus the player picked in the spot they traded down from, they're going to be embarrassed by what they left on the table with those selections. I'll take the Pepsi challenge all day long about which trio will look better today, tomorrow, next month, next year, and next decade.

Cole Sillinger, Scott Morrow, Francesco Pinelli
Tyler Boucher, Zack Ostapshuk, Ben Roger

I'm dumb enough to actually track this kind of thing for the next several years out of sheer curiosity, but I think you'll find it won't take all that long to figure out. Not to mention that at least the first group of picks is actually TRYING to add scoring line players and a potential 2nd-pairing D to the mix... the picks Ottawa made seem far more like cost-controlled replacements for guys like Watson, Amadio, and J. Brown.
- khawk

I can only assume, Ottawa did not have a ton of interest in brining in Reinhart and having to give him a lucrative contract. Would have been nice to get him for relatively cheap via trade and lock him in, but alas, this is Melnyk's team.

I'm surprised to see you as disappointed as you are seeing how this year is sort of a mess scouting-wise in what already was perceived a weak draft. While agree some of the off the board picks are frustrating in that they could have utilized picks a little better, but at the end of the day, a majority of these players may never see significant NHL ice time. Maybe I am more naive this year than last since I paid close attention to prospects last year and next to zero attention this year.

I do agree with the disappointment on not grabbing more naturally skilled players. I've had this issue with the Sens for years now. It seems they'd rather risk having a player who is well rounded probably make the NHL on a 3rd or 4th line because of that style of play rather than risk taking a skilled guy who may never be able to transition to the professional game, but if they do, could be a star. The surprising thing with this is that, most of the most impressive Sens drafted players, were skilled players who needed to work in other areas, not the well-rounded, 2-way player.

I don't think this was a failed draft but I am interested to know what the game plan is to get this team to the next step. Stu, Batherson, and Formenton should take a step this year. Tkachuk, Norris, C. Brown, and Chabot should continue the pace they have reached. Pinto, Bernard-Docker, Branstrom, and Mete should have opportunities to have break through professional campaigns. White, L. Brown, Dadonov should have opportunities to bounce back. I wonder if the team stays pat for this season to really gauge what their prospect pool is at. At a certain point, you need to start moving forward and prospects and drafts are secondary. I think that might be the feeling this draft had. It just felt like a side gig rather than a moment to shape your franchise. Maybe that will be a good thing if this team starts to be competitive or maybe it won't be and we will look back and identify this draft year as a bit of missed opportunity.

I'm excited to turn the page on the draft and get amped for the season. Should be much more entertaining than the same-8-opponents-tarp-filled season we all suffered through.

I understand the frustration picking players significantly ahead of where they are ranked. I am not 100% sure the thought process by Dorion and co but it would be nice burn assets. It happened at last years draft and happened again this year. Dorion has always been a safe draft GM. Has only a few prospects in mind and locks them up. There is no wheeling and dealing to get those prospects plus others pieces to add to the cupboard, which you should be able to do if you are going to go off the board.

Nevertheless, this years draft is more or less a crapshoot. The rankings meant less than any other year in recent memory, so I suppose you don't want to play with fire. At least they didn't pull what Montreal did...
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

That is why I said, so many teams had different lists due to how little scouts could watch this years crop of players. It truly is a crapshoot in so many ways. Any GM can state reasons as to why they liked or wanted a certain player. All for a variety of reasons.......there will be many picks down the road that could very well fall short of expectations based on where teams selected them. But on the flip side there will be players possibly taken in the 5th round that surpass expectations of a 2nd round pick.

That is why I said, so many teams had different lists due to how little scouts could watch this years crop of players. It truly is a crapshoot in so many ways. Any GM can state reasons as to why they liked or wanted a certain player. All for a variety of reasons.......there will be many picks down the road that could very well fall short of expectations based on where teams selected them. But on the flip side there will be players possibly taken in the 5th round that surpass expectations of a 2nd round pick.
- Kevin Francis

Add in the fact Ottawa haas like 2 actual scouts, they obviously are going to go with who they are familiar with.

It would be interesting to see a GM or scout give a really good take of what actually happens rather than generic comments or shots at people posting opinions online. There are elements that fans and media don't get to see.

Dorion has a reputation in the league for being a good scout / judge of future talent. Whether or not that's really fair is unclear, but we've seen him go off the board quite a bit in the past.

I do wonder after this draft if Dorion has bought into his press too much, and thinks he's the smartest guy in the room with so many reaches and off the board picks. We'll get a better idea in the next couple years as some of those reaches continue to develop
- david22

Exactly, in a few years we will be able to see how this draft truly played out, the winners and losers.